New Zealand Local Weather Forum
Weather Discussion => Hardware Software and Technology => General Computing => Topic started by: iomkiwi on May 04, 2012, 09:08:28 PM
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Those of you on Google Plus may remember me saying a while ago I was having trouble with my old PC, it was locking up and/or giving out bad static noise - usually when I actuallly ask it to actually start usinfg it resources a bit more.
I thought I would start documenting the times when it plays up so we can find the problem and maybe fix it witout spending any money (I'm still paying for the weather PC)
The PC is not essential to me, I have the wx pc (that I am typing on now) that is more than capable of handling the work of the station plus surfing, I also have an old laptop I could use.
The PC is a Dell with dual core running XP prof with 3GB ram about 5 years old.
Today 4/5/12 it restarted itself while looking at a thread that had this gif
(http://forgifs.com/gallery/d/200698-1/Bullet-time-cat-jump.gif)
it would have been runnning a couple of times in the thread (in the original post and in a reply)
Also in the thread is this you tube video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9XtK6R1QAk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9XtK6R1QAk)
and it was while watching this video that it restarted.
I went back to the thread after the pc restarted and while watching the video the pc just locked up (everything unresponsive but picture still on screen) I have to hold power button down to shut down when this happens and restart. I then went back to the thread to watch video and the pc restarted itself again - so I got on the wx pc to type this :)
I suspect it is something to do with the graphics card.
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Nice gif!
CPU - is it a combined CPU / GPU?
Memory - amount and type?
OS?
Dunno - Jenny is better at these things than me, but I like guessing games
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Its a dell I rest my case!!!!
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CPU - is it a combined CPU / GPU?
Memory - amount and type?
OS?
graphics card is seperate
memory 3GB (as I mentioned in OP) :D
OS - Xp Prof ( " " " " " ) :D :P
Jenny - that doesn't help even if you are having fun saying that :o
(you could have said something constructive like 'replace it with an HP') :D
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HP!!!!!
and you know the answer to that >:(
Ok u want constructive.
Whats the MOB?
Whats the size of the PSU?
What is the motor ( CPU )
What is the size of the Graphics? Sounds like its integrated - yes?
If so see if MOB will take an AGP card. Then buy from work.
hahahaha just let us know what the MOB is and I will look it up. You should have the MOB manual that came with it to get details off.
Then there is the cleaning. Install ccleaner. Its free on net:
http://www.filehippo.com/download_ccleaner (http://www.filehippo.com/download_ccleaner)
Also run Programs - Accessories - System Tools - Disk clean.
Then check Hard Dive:
My Computer - right click on c drive and select properties - Select Tools Tab - click on Check now - tick both boxes - click start - ok ok and reboot. Go and make coffee at this point as it will take a while.
Once back - Then defrag her.
Hows that for constructive.
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I am with jenny on this, it's a Dell and that does not help any. HP is not much better either! However . . .
Somewhere on the system case, usually on the back or the bottom there should be a sticker with a Dell ID tag number, if you can tell me what that number is then I can access the full system spec for your computer from the Dell Website, that might help here.
From your original post there seems to be two issues here and they may be related:
1. The computer has been generating "excessive noise", I presume electrical, for some time.
2. It has started rebooting itself at random. This might be a Windows error issue or it might be a mainboard Bulging Capacitors issue (See Below).
Both issues occur when the system is under load, the "noise" is more noticeable. I presume that it is stable if just sitting at the Windows desktop and not actually doing anything?
Windows issue:
Do you know how to set Windows XP to not restart the system on error so the "Blue Screen of Death" error message remains on the screen? The F8 thing at startup? If so restart the system by using F8 & selecting the Windows option to not restart on error. then select the Start Windows normally option, do not restart or reboot again. Let windows start and then try playing the same items in the same order as outlined in your original post. if the system restarts at random is should stop at the "Blue screen of Death", document the details especially the name of the error (usually in caps) towards the top of the screen and the "Stop" numbers at the bottom, plus anything else that looks specific. If you post that info I can look up the details and work out a solution.
Hardware Issues:
There could be a number of things causing this, the most likely causes are:
* A faulty or failing Power supply.
* A graphics card problem
* A mainboard problem
* A noisy (Electrically) hard drive Motor
I would try the following:
1. Replace the Power supply and see if that solves the problem. it might just solve both issues as it might not be supplyng the correct voltage to the Mainboard in the computer.
2. If the mainboard has built in graphics I would remove the add in graphics card and try it using the built in Graphics. If no onboard graphics I would try a different graphics card.
3. Check the capacitors on the Computers Mainboard to see if they are bulging either on the tops or the sides. If so basically you need a new Mainboard or a new computer but I could do a rebuild using as much as possible from the Dell like CD/DVD. HDD, Keyboard, Mouse, Monitor etc depending on their repective age and condition.
4. Try running the computer with a different Hard Drive, this will only to check for noise not the rebooting issue.
See if any of this helps, let me know how you get on.
PS. I presume that you have a good Antivirus & malware programme installed, it is up to date and you have runa a full scan recently?
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CPU - is it a combined CPU / GPU?
Memory - amount and type?
OS?
graphics card is seperate
memory 3GB (as I mentioned in OP) :D
OS - Xp Prof ( " " " " " ) :D :P
[/quote]
Sorry - was too mesmerised by the pic. Paris is getting fidgety!
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I'm still in guessing game mode - antivirus? What do you use and when did you last do a scan. Yes I know it's a longshot, but just exploring options
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Here's another angle for you.
Can you tell us what it is running in terms of programs? How about a list of its startup programs?
There's a number ways of seeing what's starting up but its likely that its trying to start two things of the same type or there's a program that should have been deleted and hasn't. Babs had two or three Epson status monitors running when one was required.
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Yes, I would go along with this angle as well: I always try for a software solution first...be interesting to see a list of what is running at start up and also what services are running at idle and a list of what programs are installed.
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it could even be a crack on the solder on motherboard?
love that cat jumping...how high?
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Not sure if I'm having fun :D
For those not on Google + this is the same PC that fried a hard drive in about October last year, so it had a replacement drive and full system recovery then, and has had ccleaner run thru it a few times since. Antivirus (Avast Professional) is up to date.
I went to Dell's site today and found they had a diagnostic tool there so thought I would run it. Went to run and it only works on IE7 or greater so I had to update (I use FF) after the upgrade it told me I had to go to windows update to update the update. After applying all updates I now have a monitor in stunning 640x480 resolution and glorious 4 bit colour!
While on the Dell site I did find that the PC may only be recognising 2 of the 3 GB it has installed.
Has been a busy 24 hours, the pc started shutting down every 10 minutes or so about 10pm yesterday - The Fourth was definitly not with it on Star Wars Day, went to a friends place this morning to sort out their new PC - a wireless printer that kept demanding a cable. Then this morning also Mum's PC wouldn't start (guess that is Revenge of the Fifth) was coming up with 'unmountable_boot_error'. Ran a chkdsk on that and it seems to have kept it alive for now, but it is a Dell the same age as my one - albeit with a lot less use.
Will let you know what comes out of the dell diagnostic, and whether I get back to a decent resolution on this 22" monitor :D
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What happens when you try and change the resolution in Display properties?
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there is no other option :(
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I went to the nvidea site and got the right drivers so resolution is back to what it should be :D
Doing the diagnostic check again, so far the only thing that has failed is the external hard drive, says it is in a state of immenent failure - not surprised as that is the one that used to be inside the pc :)
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It passed all tests except that external hard drive.
according to the Dell site it does look like it is only recognising 2GB of the 3GB Ram it originally came with.
But the system properties still say it has 3GB Ram
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So after all that I went to watch a youtube video and it crashed again :(
Here are the specs, hope everything asked for is there
General InformationService tag 971LR1S
Express Service Code 20016998704
Computer Model Inspiron 530
BIOS Vendor Dell Inc.
BIOS Version 1.0.18
BIOS Date 02-24-09
Window Version Microsoft Windows XP Professional
ProcessorManufacture Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU E4400 @ 2.00GHz
Clock Speed 2.0GHz
L2 Cahce Size 2048
MemoryAvailable Memory 73.65%
Page File Size 18014398509480961.0MB
Available Page File -414.27%
Virtual Memory 2047.0MB
Available Virtual Memory 97.99%
Memory Slot1 [DIMM_A] 0MB
Memory Slot2 [DIMM_B] 0MB
Network CardAdaptor Intel(R) 82562V-2 10/100 Network Connection - Packet
Scheduler Miniport
StorageDrive Type Driver Size Total Available Space Used Space
C:NTFS465.76Gb361.69Gb104.07Gb
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maybe try removing a memory chip, or replacing one, or even running a memory test?
it could also be a video driver dll that is the problem?
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Sounds like the drive all right. If the swap file gets corrupted, I've seen pc's reboot with no error log.
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Your page file size looks a bit big!! Is that right?
I second the idea of pulling out the RAM and reinstalling it.
If you have CC cleaner, run that and clean out the Windows Log files. Once they get big, it can slow the PC down...
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This PC is determined to try you, that's for sure.
Could you do a screen dump of the services running, perhaps and ditto what starts up?
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Playing Vedeo's on You Tube is probably one of the most stressfull things you could get that computer to do. It loads up the Internet Connection, the Video card and the mainboard Ram & CPU. If there is a problem with the Power Supply or the Video card this is when it will become evident.
My money is still on either the Power Supply, the Video card (Not the Drivers as you have now replaced those with he latest version) but most likely it is one or more bulging Capacitors on the Mainboard.
Have you been able to get a "blue screen of death" screen out of it yet, see instructions in my earlier post.
You could also try:
Check that the CPU and Power Supply fans are clean and spinning at the correct speed, slow or excessively dirty fans can cause the CPU or power supply to run hot and this can cause intermittent rebooting. Try blowing a desk fan through the system case in the same direction as the normal air flow and see if that makes any difference. You can also use a hair dryer but make sure it is on the COLD setting. You could also check the BIOS settings to see what temp the CPU is running at.
I would also remove the external Hard Drive if for nothing else to remove it from any.
If you go to this Dell website link http://www.dell.com/support/troubleshooting/us/en/19/ProductSelector and enter the service code ID as "971LR1S" yiu will be able to view the original specification details of your System when it left the Dell Factory. It may have subsequently been changed. It should be a "Dell Inspiron 530".
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I am planning on taking the cover off and eyeballing the insides, will check the seating off RAM, Cards etc and give it a clean while I am in there. Will keep an eye out for overweight capacitors as well :)
It hasn't bluescreened again yet
While the GPU test was being done via Dells site the temp got up to 70 C
If anything the thing seems to crash more often when the temp is colder?
I haven't had much time to do any looking today, have been playing with map scripts/settings so that all you guys can put a copy of it on your sites if you want :) (and the PC hasn't crashed at all while doing it)
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...put it in the oven then. :D
I would be interested to hear how dusty it was inside, when you get to it. I thought of that a day or so ago, but not all of what you describe could be attributable to dust
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My thoughts on Blue screens are when either memory is dying or hard drive sectors are starting to fail - used a lot for page files and Virtual memory, and thus address paths (or incorrect data) are lost (or corrupted) and the operation at the time crashes rather indeterminantly.
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I have the BSOD sitting there now!
No name for the stop error the numbers are
0x0000008e (0xc0000005, 0xbf81c022, 0xb820796c, 0x00000000)
Message does say to check for bios updates, pretty sure I got the latest off Dell last week (but BSOD will go if I check what version)
further message details
win32k.sys - address BF81c022 base at BF800000, date stamp 4f85831a
I can leave the BSOD there for a while in case you need anything else
service tag # for the machine is 971LR1S
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I'm thinking it may be that RAM issue, system has 3GB in it (2 x 1Gb and 2 x 512MB) but the scan on Dell's site only picked up 2GB, saying 2 slots were empty. It looks like both 512's aren't working.
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You might be on to it there. ". . . the scan on Dell's site only picked up 2GB, saying 2 slots were empty. It looks like both 512's aren't working."
Read the article at this link http://support.microsoft.com/kb/315335 but disregard the references to Setup as I have also experineced the Stop 0x50 error also mentioned here many times and every time without fail it has been faulty Ram or on some occassions dirty Ram contacts. It may also be a fault in the bus under the ram slot on the Motherboard itself which unfortunately is unfixable so either don't use that slot or replace the mainboard.
Start by removing the 2 sticks of Ram that the Dell Ram check did not recognise, run the machine as you did when it crashed and see what happens. You may need to remove all the Ram & try individually or in combinations and in different slots to isolate which is the faulty module or slot.
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Very important: never remove or insert Ram Modules while the Computer is going ald also, Remember that when handling ram you need to take proper and adequate Static precautions and do not touch the chips on the modules themselves, alway handle them by gripping on the edges at each end.
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You could also try cleaning the contacts on the bottom of the Ram Modules with a clean Cotton Bud and some Isopropol Alchol (Can get from you local friendly chemist if you don't have any but you may be asked for ID as it is used in P manufacture so don't ask for too much). Note: You can keep what is left in the fridge for later use. Also try cleaning out the Ram slots themselves by firstly sucking or blowing out any loose dust surrounding them and then cleaning gently with said same Cotton Bud an Alchol as detailed above. Be gentlle and patient, make sure that you do not leave any "fluff" from the cotton bud on the pins inside the slot but also make sure you apply sufficient pressue to clean the pins.
Hope this helps.
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You never ran memtest? Run memtest on 1 (each ) stick of ram overnight see if there are any errors (or 20-30 passes), whatever you feel like doing. I would start with the 512 sticks first, since you sus them.
If you want to have some fun :-\
And you want to be thorough ;)
Run memtest on the memory modules individually and run them in the good slots (the slots you have the 2GB is in) and run the 2GB (test) in the slots the 512 have been running in.
If the 2GB fail the test where the 512's (slots) had been and the 512's pass the test where the 2GB's had been running.
I will start to think or will be pretty certain the slots the 512's had been running in are bad.
Or test them entirely in another compatible machine..if you have one.
Most likely it is the ram...but I know if it was my comp...I would want to eliminate the slots also. I would hate to buy some ram down the road and go through the headache of discovering/testing and it was the slots that were bad.
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I think I will just retire it, maybe do a rebuild after all it isn't essential to me.
Got a "pagefault in non paged area" error message yesterday.
Have spent the last few days trying to get all the info I neede off it, think I have now finished.
Started off by just copying files onto external drive but even then it would keep crashing - and the external drive is suspect anyway. In the end I just made all files accessible and sucked them off from the wxpc
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Sorry to hear you have had a frustrating week like me. Funny my failed PC is a Dell (Dimension 5200) as well. Anyway, I have had the BSOD 0x0000008e errors before on client PC's ...and it was the memory that was causing the problem. Since you have 2x1GB and 2x512mb is worth doing the elimiation tests that Azzura suggested...you could bypass the mem test and just remove the 2x512mb simms and see how you go. If you still have a problem then remove the 2x1Gb simms and put the 512mb simms in their place. As someone else mentioned take care when removing memory as static can damage the memory.
On the front of my Dell I have 4 diagnostic lights....do you have them and if you do, have you checked to see if they are telling you anything(they only show when there is a problem)? Also have you run Dell Diagnostics - when you boot press F12 when the Dell logo appears and then boot to utility partition.